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Ah, Thanksgiving dinner. A time to eat a special meal and share traditions with family and friends. A time of food, reflection and harmony.
Harmony, that is, until the family dynamics kick in and along with the turkey and stuffing comes a nice, big helping of unsolicited parenting advice from grandparents or older relatives who've already raised their kids and would love to tell you a thing or two about how to raise yours.
Just ask Marissa Klein, a Hoboken, N.J., mom of two who has already had her fill of well-intentioned members of her extended family opining as to whether a 4 p.m. or 7 p.m. Thanksgiving dinner is best for her 8-month-old.
Klein believes, the worst offenders of unwanted advice are usually those who haven’t had a young child or an infant in some time. “Sure, I would love to give my kids to them so I can hit the cocktails and apps and throw my feet up,” she jokes. But in her experience, the relatives who are the most vocal about what a parent should do at Thanksgiving aren’t usually the ones who jump up to help with the cranky, over-tired toddler.
Many parents, after years of family holidays, have learned a few tried and true tricks in dealing with advice-amped relatives.
Suzanne Darmory, mom to Gabriel, 4, and Nathaniel, 3, says the key to coping in close quarters during the holidays is admitting that your kids aren’t perfectly behaved. If you walk into Thanksgiving dinner and are up front with everyone that your two young boys are a little rambunctious and may have a hard time sitting nicely through a grown-up meal, you’ve at least made a good preemptive strike against any unwanted tips about how to control them better, Darmory says.
As for Andrea Montalbano, a mom, soccer coach and author of the tween book "Lily Out of Bounds," handling the unsolicited advice is a lot like prepping for a soccer game.
“When I coach a team, I understand that there are going to be situations where a player’s parents want to talk to me,” she explains. But she always makes sure that it’s not in the heat of the moment, mid-game, when the kids are on the field. Montalbano says the same rules should apply to Thanksgiving dinner. If you know there’s a relative with a history of giving you mid-meal advice, go to her beforehand and ask for her words of wisdom away from the table, before the turkey comes out.
“Talk to the repeat offender before the meal gets underway,” Montalbano says. “So maybe they’ve already felt heard when everyone is seated.” And maybe seat your little guy or girl at an opposite end of the table from that person.
Jenny Rosenstrach, blogger and author of “Dinner: A Love Story”, believes the best Thanksgiving dinner gatherings are those that are well-prepared, and flexible enough to accommodate any young children who are coming to celebrate. “Nothing good can come from confronting someone in an aggressive way over turkey,” she says. “If someone says something really annoying about your child or parenting skills, bring it up on Friday. But try to maintain the sanctity of the meal as long as humanly possible.”
And it turns out a little levity can often be the most well-mannered response at the Thanksgiving table.
“A touch of humor can go a long way and defuse a situation,” says Anna Post, a modern manners author and great granddaughter of etiquette guru Emily Post. “You don’t ever have to be self-deprecating,” Post explains. “It’s more about setting boundaries. If a relative is intruding on your parenting or asking prying questions about your child, someone is pushing those boundaries, and you are simply resetting them.”
She says it’s always appropriate to respond to an older relative’s parenting advice with a polite smile, and a simple, “Thanks, I will consider it.”
Of course, in a perfect world, you’ve already been practicing with little James or Julia in advance, teaching them that when we go to grandma and grandpa’s for the holidays we use our utensils and try not to interrupt adults. But pick your battles, Post tells parents. Choose your top Thanksgiving meal proprieties. For example, she says, this Thursday, maybe focus your toddler on not throwing food— and save holding his fork properly for another, less-loaded day.
Some grandparents also know what it takes to have a drama-free holiday dinner. Deena Mack, a Connecticut grandmother of four kids under the age of 5, tells people to go with the flow when you’ve got little ones in your brood.
With nap schedules, eating habits, and varied kiddie agendas, it can be hard to have a rigid seating arrangement or formal meal, so set your expectations accordingly, suggests Mack.
The best way for everyone to enjoy the holidays with little kids, she says, is to be mindful of everyone’s different schedules and try to be as flexible and relaxed as possible -- and to always respect a young parent's wishes.
How do you deal with parenting advice at the holiday dinner table? Share your thoughts on the TODAY Moms Facebook page
Turkey day dinner brings together family and friends, but it can also cause some drama. The rules of etiquette can seem vague for this holiday, but Anna Post, co-author of "Emily Post's Etiquette: The 18 Edition," is here to make sure you can maintain harmony at your dinner table.
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Best advice? Do NOT give advice.
Who really likes to spend the day with your parents and in laws anyway? I fixed the problem with a divorce and calculated move to another state :)
My first Thanksgiving with a child in tow happened when my son was a month old. I handled it the best way that I knew how ... telling my 3 year old step-niece - who I had met that day - thank you for thinking about the baby, but he couldn't have any nuts or crab dip because he didn't have any teeth (it made sense to her and acknowledged that she just wanted to help) and I nursed my son in another room so as to avoid any awkward feelings. In subsequent Thanksgivings we tried to handle everything with a sense of humor, even though sometimes the advice was really from out of left field (a friend of my mother-in-law's has some interesting ideas about who should be the primary parent - and it wasn't/isn't my husband or myself). The hardest thing about holidays is dealing with my HUSBAND, who has higher expectations for behavior from our son than the poor kid can deliver. Hopefully tomorrow will go smoothly, but considering that his behavior has been corrupted by Kindergarten this year ... I'm apprehensive.
If there are 2 kids, that's enough for a KIDS table! I have many happy memories of being at the kids table and also of sitting with MY kids at the little table. We learned also to feed the kids before we sat down, it was a whole lot easier then jumping up and down through dinner.
Yes, however ... a 1 month old can't sit at a kids' table. lol We kept him in his carseat next to me while we were eating. These days, we do Thanksgiving with my in-laws and the kids sit with everyone. We just get their plates put together first and get them seated and then get our own. The kids eat and then get up and play. My son is generally a good kid ... and he loves his only cousin on that side so they tend to entertain each other fairly well.
"Thanks for that unsolicitied advice! I'll give it all the consideration that it deserves!"
ha ha ha....PERFECT response!!!
Grandma's Rule Number One: "It isn't my problem."
My job is to love my grandchildren without reservation. Their behavior is entirely their parents' problem. I did my job already in raising my kids and they turned out brilliantly, so now it is my turn to relax and enjoy them. They will do a fine job raising their children.
Why can't Betty be my kids grandparents?
I solved that problem. I host Thanksgiving. Our kids in our home where they can play with their toys and nap in their bed, where I have an endless supply of food that our picky 6 yr old will actually eat and where if they spill cranberry sauce on our carpet, I won't be mortified. And if my neice and nephew come by, they are already comfortable with Auntie Lola's house so they just play and have a good time with their cousins.
And this year will be even better. No family at all. Through various invitations and schedules, we will be just us this year. I'm hosting a Pajama Thanksgiving. I'm not setting the table, I'm not even bringing down the good dishes. We'll load our plates and have a carpet picnic while we watch movies, play games and best part...Jammies. I can't wait.
I agree 100%! My wife and I have not been to thanksgiving at someone elses house since we have had kids(10 years)
When the inlaws bitch about it I say, they are more than welcome to come here. Of course they don't because they know they will not be allowed to show their ass and act like judgmental pricks at my house. They don't mess with me but I got tired of hearing them constantly bicker with each other years ago!
Now, if I can ever get the same policy in place for christmas eve, I will be set. Oh well, I guess one day a year won't kill me.
I've seen people's kids today....perhaps listening to Granny might be a good idea.
blakec--well put.
Or you could teach your kids that acting like little animals won't be tolerated. Nah. You might damage their tender psyches or even worse--have to get off your lazy butts and deal with your obnoxious spawn.
THANK YOU, patter123! My Spawn (I really do call them that) are young adolescents now, but they have never been a problem at gatherings or in public places (they tagged along by necessity on every supermarket trip, bank visit, doctor's appointment, even to meet with my CPA, pretty much from birth) because they were taught how to behave like HUMANS and given credit for having the ability to do so. Parents who allow their kids to run amok because "that's what they do at this age" shouldn't have kids. Parents who excuse rude and inappropriate behavior as "normal" are LAZY. Kids used to be expected to exercise some thoughtfulness and self-control, not just in public but in their own homes as well. Not so much the case today.
Wrong. Just like we have no idea raising kids 20-40 years ago, you have no idea what is like raising kids in today's world.
Wrong. Just like we have no idea raising kids 20-40 years ago, you have no idea what is like raising kids in today's world.
Wrong. Just like we have no idea raising kids 20-40 years ago, you have no idea what is like raising kids in today's world.
Thank you! The world is not the same place it was decades ago. Just like your parents and grand parents may have been out of touch with what you were going through, so too are you.
How many of you oh so judgmental grandparents had a mother who said you were just plain lazy for using disposable diapers when she slaved away over a wash tub with your @!$%#y diapers?
This sums it up perfectly! Unless you are willing to pitch in and help, shut the @!$%# up and mind your own damn business!
I voted your comment up all three times.
Actually, grandparents aren't usually out of touch with what children are going through. Parents are.
I like the "jammie party" idea. I may run away from home.
My family don't give advice unless you ask for it. Thank goodness.
What's the point of giving advice. When most people won't take your advice anyhow.
Since my husband is deathly allergic to turkey (even the smell of it cooking causes his airways to close up), everyone in my family insists that turkey is THE only Thanksgiving meat, and my husband's family live hundreds of miles away, it's always just the four of us. Our place is too small to host. The funny thing is, our two daughters (now ages 7-1/2 and 10) are the children that people WANT at their gatherings (and that's not just me saying it).
I do not have children, but I can tell you that perfect strangers as well as family have no filter and will say whatever they want to you. Noboby minds their own business anymore.
I read something online about a guy who was standing at a bridge, looking down at the trains below during his morning walk. Apparrently he didn't look "happy" enough for some busybody, who called the police, claiming he was suicidal, and this man was about an hour late for work because the police interrogated him for a half an hour. Unbelievable....I hope he said something to that woman.
Anyone ever hear the phrase "Get back in your own lane"?
You mean, like, "Thank you so much for caring enough about me and my well-being that you would take a moment out of your own busy life to be sure that I was well and safe"?
Ever hear the phrase, "Love your neighbor as yourself"?
You mean, like, "Thank you so much for caring enough about me and my well-being that you would take a moment out of your own busy life to be sure that I was well and safe"? Ever hear the phrase, "Love your neighbor as yourself"?
You don't get it, do you? He was MINDING HIS OWN BUSINESS gazing at the trains, when a total stranger takes it upon herself to call the police and claim he is suicidal. He was almost committed to a psych ward. According to what I read, he almost lost his job, and his employer was also rather annoyed at the woman's presumptuousness. All that hassle, because of one person's AUTOMATIC ASSUMPTION/JUDGEMENT. This woman did NOT know this man she did NOT know his circumstances. Who is she to deem him suicidal? She doesn't know as much as she thinks.
Strangers have NO BUSINESS telling another person how to raise their child. They are called STRANGERS for a reason, they do NOT know that person's circumstances, they do NOT know that person and what works best for them, so they do NOT know what they're talking about. No one asked them anyway.
Parents are doing the best they can, they are trying to learn these things for THEMSELVES, and a lot of times, it just makes it worse to have somebody stick their nose in, ESPECIALLY when they are already stressed enough, and it was NOT asked for. I can see how that would be irritating. I'd be thinking "just trying to get through a tough day, why can't people just leave me be?"
This is a bit off subject but it still covers unwanted advice. Like the time I was waiting for the bus, people were talking amongst themselves, I was sitting there thinking quietly when all of a sudden a perfect stranger says...."Why are you so quiet, honey? Don't you ever talk? You should talk more often." *trainofthoughtinterrupted*. So I told her, "Why are you so loud? Don't you ever stop talking? I was thinking about what business I need to take care of first when you interrupted my train of thought. No offense, but that question is a bit nosy, and there is NOTHING bad about being quiet, lady." To my surprise, a couple of people there actually took my side and UNDERSTOOD where I was coming from. That is the PERFECT example of unsolicited advice from a TOTAL stranger, that was pretty irritating.
That lady did NOT know my situation. She did NOT know my circumstances, so who the hell was she to tell me that I'm too quiet and to talk more? Who did she think she was, my mother?....no I don't think so. I don't take advice from people who do NOT know me.
I might've had a burglary, and been feeling upset. I might've had a bad fight with a friend or family member. I might've been having a very stressful, overwhelming day, and wanted to be left alone. I might've had my clothes splashed by @!$%# drivers, and been cold and pissed off enough to begin with. I might've been harassed by some perv while walking to the bus stop, and trying to calm myself. My friend might be having an emergency and I needed to come as quickly as I could, maybe I was worried enough without her "advice". My relative might've died for all she knew. Granted, NONE of these were the case, but it WAS possible. What if she had told me to talk more often, only to find something like that out? I bet she would've wished she had let me be.
If you are a STRANGER, you do NOT know other peoples' circumstances, what's going on with them....you don't even know them AT ALL, and you need to keep it to yourself. Usually, it goes in one ear and out the other. Usually it comes off as annoying and intruding. Usually it is DISREGARDED, so you are just wasting your breath.
Even if you want to be helpful, and don't intend to make things worse, sometimes unsolicited advice does just that, leaves someone annoyed and stressed, and wondering "who on earth was that?".
Ever hear the phrase "The road to hell is paved with good intentions?"
When I was a kid, my Grandma's house had a basement, and not only did the kids spend most of the holiday down there, we even had our kids table down there. Our family was brilliant. The kids enjoyed playing with each other and having their own special area to eat in, and the parents and other childless relatives got some peace and quiet. I was the youngest and when I was about 9 the kids table went away and we sat with the adults, and there was never a problem with anyone acting out so badly that they needed anything more than an "ahem" from their mother to make them cut it out.
I'm going to take a different angle than most of the posters here. This is really an American cultural issue and while I guess everyone is entitled to their own way it's rather sad. I've been around groups that function very well as extended families. Parents value the vast experience that grandparents have in raising children and in life in general. For their part, the elders gently guide and are not overbearing. Grandparents sometimes even do a lot of the child raising as they can no longer work outside the home but they feel valued for what they contribute to the family as a whole. The younger parents do the hard work to bring in food/money but are relieved of a lot of the constant childcare. When they get older it's their turn. The children benefit from the elders who are generally more patient than the younger parents.
I look at the article above and feel sort of sad for them. I know our culture used to be more like that and I think we've lost something.
The only problem our extended family had at Thanksgiving occurred while watching the Redskins-Cowboys game where my brother had Tony Romo on a fantasy team and a niece, a fierce Redskins fan from the D.C. suburbs, got upset and red-faced every time the Cowboys scored as they almost came from way back to win while my brother was smiling. And I, a Ravens fan like my brother, didn't help by singing (to the tune of the Notre Dame fight song): "Three cheers for the Redskins, what the heck. They're going to get it right in the neck. Send a mournful prayer on high, as the whole team lays down to die. What though the odds may be great or small, old R G Three will fumble the ball, while their loyal fans get sick and switch over to the Ravens." Later I got a deserved "I'd a smacked you if we had lost!"
I don't mind unsolicited advice because I know I don't know everything and I know people are, generally, trying to help. However, my husband gave me the BEST advice after I overwhelmingly told him that I don't know what to do as a new mom when everyone is giving me advice. We had just watched our mothers argue over who had the best remedy for our 2 month old son's cradle cap. My husband said, "I tell that person thank you for their advice then I do what I want to do anyway". I have been following HIS advice ever since. We said thank you to our mothers for their well-intentioned advice and we continued to use our own remedy to get rid of our son's cradle cap. And our remedy worked perfectly. Our son is 6 years old now and none the wiser. Our mothers don't know that we didn't follow their advice either. We now take advice with a grain of salt. I guess family members and friends have realized that we most likely won't take their advice anyway because we know our sons best. Our sons are 6 and 8 and I can honestly say we rarely get advice from anyone now. :)
Parents should trust that they did a good job raising their children and let us raise our own children. If I ask for advice, by all means give me your opinion. If my sons are in danger, then you have every right to step in. But 9 times out of 10, parents are raising their kids the way their parents raised them so we are already going off of our family's advice to some degree. I mean we turned out OK so give new parents some credit that they know what they're doing and that they'll figure it out.